Cable for Damascus/Blades

#1 · April 10, 2023, 10:26 am

Quote from Ed Caffrey on April 10, 2023, 10:26 am
Recently a topic that popped up on the ABS forums, and prompted me to write this post.

Often times those who are starting out, get the very wrong impression that cable is a great way to learn "Damascus" and/or Forge Welding. Starting out with, or trying to combine cable with other steels, is severely handicapping your chances of success.

IMO, there are two major reasons....

1. You're attempting to forge weld a bunch of tiny round "rods", that continually try to slip/slide past each other when you hammer/forge it. Of course the technique of rotating into the twist, among other things, as you hammer can be used, but that's a technique that requires a lot of time and effort to get right.

2. Cable is typically all one alloy. As such, where does the "pattern" come from in a finished piece? It comes from decarb between each individual wire....the more decarb (within certain limits), the better the pattern, BUT...keeping in mind that pretty much anything we do in Bladesmithing is a "give-n-take" situation, the better the pattern in a finished piece of cable, the poorer quality of a blade it will produce. To help you understand, consider this: Let's suppose the individual wires in your cable are .020" diameter, and let's say during the course of forge welding, you decarb to a depth of .010"... understand that means from all the way around each individual wire. So before ever forging a blade, you have pretty much wrecked the material from a stand point of being hardenable. Now before anyone has a tizzy....that is simply and example to help you understand why I feel cable is a poor choice for quality blade steel.

Plainly stated, the chances of early success when it comes to "Damascus" are far better with stacking/laminating individuals pieces/strips of 1080 and 15N20. Those two alloys are very similar, and forge welding them is about as easy as it gets.

Just so it's known, and because the idea for this post came from the ABS forums. By the time an individual joins the ABS (American Bladesmith Society) , I personally make the assumption that they have dedicated themselves to a higher standard, in both usability, and fit/finish of their knives. When I reply to posts on the forum, I do so from that perspective. I'm not saying don't experiment and have fun, that's how we learn, and Bladesmithing/Knifemaking is a vocation of endless learning..... but as a member of the ABS, anything you put out there for public consumption, needs to be to a higher standard. In the words of Wayne Goddard, who was one of my mentors... "A custom knife needs to be three things:"

1. Look Good

2. Feel Good

3. Work Good

Sounds very simple...until you put it into practice. 😉

Recently a topic that popped up on the ABS forums, and prompted me to write this post.

Often times those who are starting out, get the very wrong impression that cable is a great way to learn "Damascus" and/or Forge Welding. Starting out with, or trying to combine cable with other steels, is severely handicapping your chances of success.

IMO, there are two major reasons....

1. You're attempting to forge weld a bunch of tiny round "rods", that continually try to slip/slide past each other when you hammer/forge it. Of course the technique of rotating into the twist, among other things, as you hammer can be used, but that's a technique that requires a lot of time and effort to get right.

2. Cable is typically all one alloy. As such, where does the "pattern" come from in a finished piece? It comes from decarb between each individual wire....the more decarb (within certain limits), the better the pattern, BUT...keeping in mind that pretty much anything we do in Bladesmithing is a "give-n-take" situation, the better the pattern in a finished piece of cable, the poorer quality of a blade it will produce. To help you understand, consider this: Let's suppose the individual wires in your cable are .020" diameter, and let's say during the course of forge welding, you decarb to a depth of .010"... understand that means from all the way around each individual wire. So before ever forging a blade, you have pretty much wrecked the material from a stand point of being hardenable. Now before anyone has a tizzy....that is simply and example to help you understand why I feel cable is a poor choice for quality blade steel.

Plainly stated, the chances of early success when it comes to "Damascus" are far better with stacking/laminating individuals pieces/strips of 1080 and 15N20. Those two alloys are very similar, and forge welding them is about as easy as it gets.

Just so it's known, and because the idea for this post came from the ABS forums. By the time an individual joins the ABS (American Bladesmith Society) , I personally make the assumption that they have dedicated themselves to a higher standard, in both usability, and fit/finish of their knives. When I reply to posts on the forum, I do so from that perspective. I'm not saying don't experiment and have fun, that's how we learn, and Bladesmithing/Knifemaking is a vocation of endless learning..... but as a member of the ABS, anything you put out there for public consumption, needs to be to a higher standard. In the words of Wayne Goddard, who was one of my mentors... "A custom knife needs to be three things:"

1. Look Good

2. Feel Good

3. Work Good

Sounds very simple...until you put it into practice. 😉

Matt Kirby has reacted to this post.

Ed Caffrey, ABS Mastersmith "The Montana Bladesmith" "Nobody Cares What you Know, Until they Know You Care!"

#2 · April 10, 2023, 1:33 pm

Makes perfect sense to me.

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